Tesla Batteries Last Forever (Basically)

Tesla Batteries Last Forever (Basically)


– New data suggests that Tesla batteries are gonna last almost 25
years, basically forever. Back in April I shared some data about Tesla battery degradation. There are some users that have been updating this Google Doc
file for quite a while now and so we have some
surprising new findings related to this data. The data are collected by Tesla owners draining their battery down to 0%, then charging fully up to 100%. And this way, they get
a consistent measure of how much energy the battery can hold. But people ask, “The battery
in my laptop and my phone “are the same as the car right, “they’re both lithium ion batteries, “yet after only a couple years “my phone and my laptop really
can’t even hold a charge, “so wouldn’t the same thing
happen to my Tesla car?” Many studies on lithium ion battery cells indicate that after about 500 cycles at 100 depth of discharge,
battery capacity drops to around 70%; with
some studies indicating that this drop happens
at closer to 800 cycles. Either way, at 500 to 800 cycles, this means that your battery life and thus range will sharply decline somewhere around 100
to 150 thousand miles. However, when users drain
only part of the battery, as most common users of
electric vehicles and Teslas do, the battery life expectancy
rises quite a bit. I couldn’t find studies
on this type of usage, but estimates are somewhere
between 1200 and 1500 cycles, which would be closer to
350 thousand miles of life. So because empirical
studies on EV battery life, as frequently used as
these are doesn’t exist, the data we have from these
users is a bit more valuable. It’s also probable that there are other contributing
factors, like temperature and usage patterns, to the
data we have from these users. You see, when you charge a Tesla, you typically only go up to about 80% and you rarely ever get
it down all the way to 0. Hopefully not anyways. And this is to reduce
strain on the battery. Tesla may also limit your ability to use the super chargers,
or that is to use the fast charging, because it
also can damage your battery. But who the hell are they to tell you when you can charge anyways? Well they’re the ones that are ensuring you don’t ruin that expensive battery that is in your car and
so they are gonna try to prevent that, because they want you to have a great experience. And really do you need more than 250 miles on a daily commute? If you do, you may wanna
look into other options. This is why you can only go up to 80%, unless you are going on a trip. And in fact, that’s what
it’s called, trip mode, and you can put it up to 100% and get that added range when you need it. So this could be a big factor in why Tesla batteries
appear to last so long. In running my regression
analysis on the data, I found that there is
a lot of variability, meaning that there’s
not a really tight curve or trend that we can identify. In fact, there’s a lot of different points that bounce around. And that is likely
because the testing here isn’t happening in a
controlled environment. According to the analysis
by Maarten Steinbuch, professor of Systems & Control at Eindhoven University of Technology, when he was looking at this data he found that on average the batteries have 92% remaining at
240 thousand kilometers. If the linear behavior would continue, then the lifetime; meaning
still 80% capacity left; can be calculate as follows. 92 – 80=12% * 45,000 km=540,000 km. Another study I saw from jehugarcia, another YouTuber who is
just all about batteries, found that an early Tesla
battery cell he tested shows about .35% degradation per year. So that’s without use, so this
is how much capacity it loses just sitting on the shelf,
because people do have this notion that batteries just go bad. In his testing that’s what he found. This is a legit test; you
can go watch the video. The deal about it is that
if you do the math on that, after about 285 years is
when you’ll see the battery be dead and lose almost
all of it’s capacity. So yeah, I wouldn’t worry too much. So being conservative and saying that the battery will retain more than 80% of it’s capacity for up
to 500 thousand kilometers, which is 310 thousand miles, for us here in the United States. The average person, in the U.S. anyway, drives around 13,500 miles per year. We’re looking at about 23 years before you need to
replace the Tesla battery. 23 years, like 15 years after your battery warranty runs out. 13 years after cars
become fully autonomous. And even four years after my
son can legally buy alcohol. And about 10 years after robots take over the world and
enslave all of humanity. Okay, that last one may come
a bit sooner, we’ll see. The point is by the time
your Tesla battery runs out, we’ll be in a whole new world. You may not even want to drive or even have a car that you actually own. In fact, Elon recently stated
that he thinks in 20 years, we won’t even have
steering wheels in cars. So rest easy when it comes to worrying about your Tesla battery. There are lots of other things that could go wrong before then. And the data we have
here, which is real data from real people, indicates
that it’s gonna be the least of your worries If you’re into data and
Tesla and things like this, please consider subscribing to our channel by clicking the button down below. And if you wanna make sure
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email list at teslanomics.co. Thanks for watching and remember, when you free the data,
your mind will follow. I’ll see you back here next time.

100 thoughts on “Tesla Batteries Last Forever (Basically)

  1. If you loved this video check out my latest video on a potential Lithium shortage here – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RWIo-j7V7c

    Thanks for your continued support!

  2. A tesla used commercially went through 3 batteries in 3 years 400,000 km being super charged so every 130,000 k which makes for an expensive ride.

  3. This is not called tesla!! Get it right!! The real tesla produced unlimited energy…its just another business of making money instead of using gas and everything is still made to loose more money and they will be charging for the battery charge just like gas so they can make more money, everything is still the same cycle just in different use….nothing still have changed yet!

  4. Great – now all you have to do is persuade Tesla of this and get them to write a no-quibble 20 year battery warranty (underwritten at Lloyds just in case they don't survive that long) and I'll buy one.

  5. This is a total lie in three years your batteries die end of story – a three year old gas car is just warming up – Tesla is clearly lying

  6. Does anyone know what are the dimensions of the battery cover for the model 3? Also, what is the maximum temperature it gets when the car is running?

  7. So why if you own a 60 wh battery model s or model x 2015 below your battery warranty has expired this year if you were the first buyer 6 year now? Or why is the model c battery warranty is 8 years or 100 thousand miles what ever comes first? Telsa don’t want to chance the risk so he has pass the risk to you. You have a choice to risk having to pay 20 thousand + if the battery goes bad or paying 9 thousand for a warranty extension for 50 thousand more miles.

  8. Probably does depend on the quality of the battery. So Tesla's might well last a lot longer than others (Nissan Leaf and GM volt jump to mind)

  9. This is a horrible claim check your definition of forever lol but but a strong claim is to say out live the vehicle itself

  10. In Tesla's they are Nicel-cobal-aluminium batteries if you want so. But of course the main tech is lithium-ion. Why do many people don't understand / recognize that when thinking about such problems / questions? nonaggressive

  11. As soon as Tesla has a lifetime battery warranty, Tesla and I will agree with you. Is your channel receiving any compensation from Tesla sales referrals? I like to know which channels are advertising.

  12. Love this, as if you ask Canadian why they will not buy a Tesla car, its about replacing that expensive battery pack. As we all know about the model S, from 2013 or earlier, the drive train would fail frequently before the warranty was up. The moving parts, door handles, wipers, sun roof.

  13. In less than 25 years, this planet will be at the beginning of a several hundred year Mini Ice Age, brought on because of a Solar Nova event. You can laugh and scoff, but this is a Fact, based upon scientific historical data records.

  14. This stuff is great, but it isn't how lithium-ion batteries work. The cells will deteriorate rapidly after about 8-10 years of mild use. Electric car charging circuits are designed to be easy on the pack, never charging to 100% (full charge) and never allowing 100% discharge. They operate the battery pack between about 30% and 90% charge, so it lasts a long time. That means your electric car's 60 kWh battery actually can store, and deliver, about 100 kWh of energy if it were fully charged and fully discharged–something that's never done, in the interests of battery longevity.
    No matter how you use a li-ion battery, it will eventually lose its capacity very quickly after a certain period of time–and that includes brand new bateries that were never used at all.
    But, for cars, about 8-10 years before losing 1/3 capacity is very good.

  15. also tesla battery have a bit different alloy than laptop one. A bit less capacity per cell but longer lifetime (or smth like that)

  16. Oh to be young and think 25 years is forever. When you are 40 come back and say 25 years is basically forever. You are absolutely right about depth of discharge and how it affects battery life though.

  17. Tesla is genius, Elon musk is genius, the guys who created the 1s5 roadster is genius. They are gem of humanity. Thanks for not being greedy

  18. Tesla has been around for 15 years, so there are no data saying tesla batteries last 25 years. Those are only expectations, not actual data. Also, the graph you show here says that there are very few teslas with over 100000 miles. So it's still to early to have statistically significant results. However there are some that are close to 80% capacity at less than 40000 miles…thats not very reassuring.

  19. I will personally beat to death everybody, who will tell me, that I don't need steering wheel in my car. I'm huge fan of EVs, but not at this cost.

  20. New Data Suggests" Tesla stock is tanking and all these audi , bmw and Porsche all electric cars are coming on line. The battery may last forever but the company wont.

  21. Tesla Supercharging stations charge with up to 145 kW of power distributed between two adjacent cars, with a maximum of 120 kW per car. That is up to 16 times as fast as public charging stations; they take about 20 minutes to charge to 50%, 40 minutes to charge to 80%, and 75 minutes to 100%.

  22. Well, you should be a preacher, really! As much enthusiasm and optimism as I have for e-mobility, you are bending the facts a bit too hard there!

  23. What a load pf speculation. Even he says its not firm data because of the real way they are used. And the daily mileage limit is not based on any research.

  24. Когда уже индеец Соколиный Глаз заметит, что в зарядном устройстве смартфонов нет клеммы заземления? Аккумуляторы от этого и имеют низкий срок службы..неправильные блоки питания. Не? Ну ладно.

  25. Dude, the battery cells in a Tesla are basically the SAME that have been used in laptop batteries for years.

    So this argumentation is bullshit. Theres actually a lot of "data" from laptop batteries (btw, I dont think you have the proper background to talk about this matter).

  26. the saying goes

    "Free your mind, and your ass will follow (the kingdom of heaven is within)."

    Mad luv your info anyway…

    Parliament/Funkadelic forever!!

  27. Its easy to project from a graph and make such fantastical claims with the veneer of scientific credibility.

    I have a hard time believing this , seeimg how this fly contrary to all the experience i had faced in the past – every phone, laptop, torch, toy, camera i have owned, used or seen. None of them seem to hold even 50% even after 5 years. Thats the graph i am sticking to. Tesla uses cells similar to and based on the ones used in laptop batteries. The newer cells are customized for EVs but still they are subjected to harsher strain. My laptop never was left outdoors, used in the rain, snow, dust, driven at 100kmph on rough terrain or had birds crap on it. Yet most of my laptop batteries flat out died within 5 years. No doubt tesla battery cells are better built and have amazing battery management systems. But 25 years? This isn't Hogwarts.

    I am a tesla fan and optimistic that EV is the future. But this channel is a cult.

  28. @teslanomics with Ben Sullins have you come across any research on Tesla batteries in lobby term storage? I have a new model 3 performance that I've had to leave in the states while I'm working abroad. Do you know the best way to store the car? It won't be driven much, if at all, while I'm away for over a year. Thanks in advance!

  29. What happens to second hand cars in 30, 40 or 50 years from now though? Given the battery is one of the most expensive components of electric vehicles, I can't help but think about what 1st car buyers will be faced with….a car with drastically reduced range or the need to buy a new battery at considerable cost.

  30. If recycled lithium and other rare earth metals from the battery pack can’t be recycled in a new Tesla EV battery but lower grade cells it’s still a consumption product in my eyes. I hope they will find a way to change this in the near future.

  31. I believe with the nature of competition and the desire to improve current battery technology in 10 to 15 years time the cost to replacing an EV battery will only be a few thousand dollars instead of donating a kidney for funds, thus in theory selling the car with a new battery providing you keep it in good order should mean EV's will have an edge in the market on resale value.

  32. marketing bullshit , it last 4 years then earning light will ask to replace battery
    yellow mouse kid pushes shit in mass

  33. We'll see, where I live it is 120 miles to the nearest Walmart and it often gets 20' below zero. I wonder if I jumped in my tesla, turned on the heater and windshield wipers, if it would even make the trip?

  34. Would be great if other manufacturers could do this as well. Drilling machines, speakers, vibrators, whatever people use lithium batteries in.

  35. Look at his description and realize that he is a paid shill. When someone is a paid shill then you know you are only being told half of the story.

  36. Tesla owmers are freaking morons. Read BatteryUniversity. com. All Li chemistries die by 10 years. ALL OF THEM. It's time bound loss, not mileage bound. You aren't special. You're stupid.

  37. Nice Piece. The range of 20 to 80% charge over time will best preserve the battery for the long term. Ludacrous and supercharging can also lower the life of the battery

  38. By the time the battery is degraded you will probably be able to buy a future much better battery and very cheaply as costs are going down. And who would turn down a solid state battery upgrade which will run 1000 miles.

  39. There is a huge difference between 25 years and for ever. And it's not (Basically)
    So are you telling us 25 years is the same as 25.000, 250.000 or 2.500.000, basically?
    Just remember this little fact . . . . we have no idea what for ever is.

  40. I'll believe that when I experience it, in 25 years time.
    Until then, I'll assume you're lying to make sales.

  41. Tesla refuses to warrant their batteries due to the rapid degradation. They consider capacity loss outside the warranty, and if there is a workmanship failure, they only replaced use batteries with like used capacity. So Tesla cars are warranty free, you get ZERO warranty.

  42. The dutch professor you mentioned had a Tesla from 2013 and he sold the car a few months ago.. But he had his 3rd battery in the car.. He had to get 2 new ones in it because of,…?? failure !

    That's also the truth.. Did he mention that ??!! NO, …. Why not.. ?

  43. So do these cars have a charging system while driving like an alternator to help with range and helping with power consummation. Or does it totally rely on the battery charge.

  44. For wide adoption of Electric vehicles , Tesla needs to be able to charge 400 Mile range EV in the same amount of time it takes to fill up a gas tank. Five minutes.

  45. So 1972 Ford F250 4×4 with a stock big block its 47 years old starts and runs absolutely perfect, rarely has it ever stranded me on the side of the road, the alternator went out a few years back in Quartzsite AZ, took me less then an hour and $50.00 bucks to repair it. It has ZERO stupid ass electronics like all you fools willing to pay for. Lets see what last longer my 47 year old Ford truck or your stupid snowflake money pit.

  46. Got it, so the Tesla battery will keep ~80% of charge for 25 years or 335,000 miles (average of 13,500 miles/year). That's pretty good, I would still get the long battery for sure though

  47. It would be amazing that people with channels like yours, talking about batteries that are extremely toxic for the environment, could chose their words more carefully and include the environment in their analysis. Forever=25 years does not sound really accurate when talking about e-waste. Please consider that you are informing so, try to not forget about the environment. Thanks

  48. the statement of "Teslanomics with Ben Sullins" is nonsense and makes no sense, because constant charging and discharging as in Any battery will create internal deposits in form of sludge. This will cause the internal resistance of the battery to build up until it has to be replaced. Thats why I call this statement pure nonsense:
    "Tesla Batteries Last Forever (Basically)"

  49. I have had my 18650 lithium-Ion batteries for 5 years. They are still
    working perfect under load. I use them in my 6-wheel drive Autonomous Robot. It
    weighs 20lbs. Load current is from 500mA to 4000mA with speed controls, Mini
    Maestro 12 channel and a PIC16F887 for the brains. I still get 1 hour of
    running time

  50. Tesla batteries will never last even more than 10 years. Love this channel and the reviews but you're wrong on this one.

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